Getting Downhearted

[Punisher]

I know that this is a worn out out story, but I just have to vent. I lost another one of my last turkey hunting strongholds to out of state deer hunters. I have consistently lost a farm every year for the last ten years or so. I have offered money, but it wasn't ever enough. It seems like deer hunting has ruined every other hunting.  I won't even take my kids hunting because I don't want them to get as wrapped up in hunting as I have with no place to enjoy it. I talked with a Kentucky Department of Fish and Wildlife Services employee about residents having nowhere to hunt now, and he point blank told me that they make three to four more times off nonresident hunters (for deer) and have to go where the money is. Leases in my area have gotten ridiculous. Could I afford it? Yes. Do I want to take away from giving my family good vacations and keeping my wife and I in newer dependable vehicles? No. Why should anyone have to make that decision? Is that what hunting has came to? Sorry to offend anyone, but I remember a time of trading out hunts. A time before antler envy, or greed. Whatever you want to call it.

[Sir-diealot]

I understand where you are coming from, to me it is getting to the point that it is going to get to where only the rich can hunt the way it was or is in England as I have been told or remember reading about in history books where only the nobles could hunt. I hate leasing myself, I think it has ruined hunting for the common person.

As far as Antler envy or any other way you may want to put it I think TV shows have both helped and hurt hunting, I remember when they were first on it was good quality stuff, the hunt was the prize, now it seems that antler are all many people see, I have had people tell me I have no right to shoot a younger deer, my attitude is younger deer taste better so I am going to take them first, you can't eat antlers. I see very poor to marginal shots taken on animals on TV shows with bows in particular and I think that makes newer people do the same all trying to get that antler no matter what it takes and because they think that is how it should be done. I have seen people bragging about taking straight on shots on a deer with a bow or quartering to shots or the so called Texas heart shot, something I was always taught to avoid at all costs as they are not high percentage shots with a bow for sure and in some cases a gun. I see people bragging about taking spine shots, maybe with a gun but I am not even sure I would ever intentionally take that shot, it may drop the animal but it may well only paralyze it making it suffer for however long it takes you to make a follow up shot, I do not think animals feel pain quite the way we do, but you have to respect what you are hunting and take an ethical shot or stay out of the woods as far as I am concerned. Mind you I am not talking about a deer jumping the string or a bullet/arrow getting deflected, I am talking about intentionally targeting bad or cruel shot placement with that "No matter what it takes" attitude.

[Happy]

Sorry you lost some good ground. However in my opinion you are coming off as selfish and spoiled. Why do you have the right to be upset over what someone else does with their ground? That's like me complaining that Bill Gates wont give me his money. As I tell my kids, if you dont like it then do something about it. Sounds to me like you have three options.
1. Buy your own ground.
2. Pony up the cash to compete with other leasers.
3. Hunt public ground.
I can agree that the modern hunting/deer farming scene leaves little room for the average person. I am not a fan of it for different reasons than hunting ground but it ain't gonna change anytime soon. I am not trying to be a jerk but someone else's property is theirs to do with as they see fit. Some people get better breaks than others in life, others bust their rear ends and earn it. However the opportunity is there for most. It's just a matter of making it happen. Not trying to be a jerk but I think you are looking at it from an extremely selfish stand point.


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[Southerngobbler]

Is it even worth it to live in a world where one has to decide between his luxury items or exclusive use of someone else's hunting land?
When life has dealt you a hand that crappy you can always set up a Go Fund me account on Facebook.

[Spitten and drummen]

Bottom line , you have to pay to play. Not trying to sound harsh but what you posted is a Liberal mindset. This is America where you pay your way. You cannot fault others who can afford it or landowners who want to make as much as possible. I lease 1100 acres for turkey rights only. It cost me 5 grand a year. I am a regular ole guy with a decent job. I sacrifice  through the year and save to pay it. I have a wife and 2 kids and they are taken care of first but I manage. Its the world we live in.

[crow]

To me the most disturbing part of what you wrote is the statement about not taking your kids hunting for the reasons you stated.


I would take them to public ground before not going at all, kids need to be out there hunting. Put some time in and find some out of the way places to take them.

[Sir-diealot]

To me the most disturbing part of what you wrote is the statement about not taking your kids hunting for the reasons you stated.


I would take them to public ground before not going at all, kids need to be out there hunting. Put some time in and find some out of the way places to take them.

Completely agree with this.

[Yoteduster]

I lease alot of ground for turkey,deer and duck hunting mainly to get away from public hunting and the idiots that go with it and yes it can get a little pricey but I also sublease some of it and take a few hunters on guided hunts and make back most of what I pay out..there's an old saying if there's a will there's a way

[Sixes]

I guess it is just geographical differences. I am 49 and have been in lease clubs since I was 18 and my Dad has paid since the 70s.

Leasing is nothing new, y'all are just now catching up.

I hate that you lost your hunting, but you cannot blame someone for offsetting their income on their land just so you want to hunt.

I would be curious as to how much land leases for up there, I know several guys that lease land in KY and they pay about the same to hunt bigger deer as we do here in GA.

[fallhnt]

Hunt public. I enjoy it. I turn down offers to lease and hunt on private.  No obligations and I shoot any legal animal I see. I come and go as I please and nobody to get upset about something.

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[eggshell]

I will side with Punisher here, but concede that landowners are free to do with their land as they please. I do not think punisher is greedy or selfish. There are many who get shut out because they don't have the resources, a warm home and food on the table are far more important. I grew up in a time where people were neighborly and letting people hunt was a way of life and a kindness extended. We owned and farmed hundreds of acres and anyone who didn't trash our land was welcome. The thought of shutting everyone out just for money would have been an offense to my father. We still own land and some of our family members have decided they'd rather have the money. My sister lives on the old home place and does not solely own it, but still they decided to lease it and now I can't even hunt my own home place. Yeah it sucks. Thankfully the rest of the family feels different and none of us lease our holdings (over 1,000 acres) and have no intent to. I still let people hunt for free and it is my way of Loving my neighbor as Christ advised. I actually think it is more of a form of greed to shut out your family and friends for money. It is harming hunting and one of the reasons it's declining. we do control who hunts our land so those we let hunt have a safe high quality hunt. It's mostly family and neighbors. I allow some out of staters and out of towners to hunt mine.

Another aspect is the way lease holders act. I am surrounded by leased land and it is a constant fight to keep them off my land. They do not care as "we don't live here". Last year a guy and his son hunting on me called me and said some guy was trying to run them off claiming he had it all leased. I jumped in my truck and headed their way. when I got there they said he ran off when they said the land owner is on his way. Didn't do him any good because I knew where he came from. He paid for that stunt. I regret to say that adjoining land owner and I used to be good friends and now seldom speak, because he thinks I'm being an as##ole running his leasers off and pressing charges on them. Yeah I hate leasing too

[Greg Massey]

I see the point of all these post, my suggestion is keep trying to find land and pay for a lease , it's cheaper than owning land ... as for the kids , always teach them about the outdoors and take them hunting .. good luck ...

[Punisher]

Just trying to vent. Obviously, by some of your remarks, you don't remember what it used to be like to gain permission with a friendly handshake. Happy, I think the people leasing ground are the selfish ones. They are afraid of competition. Unable to kill something unless they are the only people hunting there. I have tagged out on longbeards for the last twenty three years on heavily pressured private ground. I just hate seeing where hunting is going. Obviously the generation of "I don't want any competition. I can't handle it." Just for general knowledge, not bragging at all, with my wife's and my salary, we are WELL above the national average, but I do not lease out of principal. Why would I take that money away from my family for a stupid deer or turkey?  Sorry. Rant over. Just so everyone is clear, in now way do I blame the landowners.

[perrytrails]

I understand your feelings but unfortunately we are living in todays world, things change and if we aren't happy it is up to us to change it.

I've had very few private properties to hunt over the last 40 years. Always hunted public land and I'm thankful there is a bunch of it around me.

It's what I like to do, what I enjoy. There maybe a day I don't have much public land to hunt, I'm very aware of that.

Take your kids hunting, if they have to learn it takes scouting, woodsmen-ship, and hard work to be as successful as the big money guys, they will appreciate it more, be better more skilled hunters.

They learn a lesson about life that's no longer taught to most kids.

You reap what you sew...

[eggshell]

In some areas it may be cheaper to buy some land Gregg. I will just quit hunting before I pay out a significant part of my retirement income for a lease. I am lucky I don't have to because I own land, but if I didn't I would not pay. There are a lot of us older retired hunters that live on fixed incomes that seriously can not afford  the lease prices. We like food, clothes and homes more. So they're left hunting public or quitting. Many young people are in the same boat. Take a young couple with two kids and a home mortgage and average income, and no savings to speak of. They can't afford to spend thousands of dollars for a hunting lease that is only used a few times a year...

There's always another side. Kudos to those of you who have the resources and can do it, but there are more who can't. It definitely is hurting recruitment of new hunters. I do not begrudge you for having your leases, but I do ask that you respect the landowner's around you. Many areas do not have much public land