Question about Missouri

[GobbleNut]

Hunting regulations are generally either "biologically" based or they are "ethically" based.  For instance, we don't shoot hens in the spring season because we want to assure the future of wild turkey populations by protecting nesting hens to insure adequate recruitment of new turkeys into the population each year,...a biological reason. 

On the other hand, for the most part, states don't allow "roost shooting" due to ethical reasons,...taking an unfair advantage of game.  There is really no biological reason for doing that, however. 

Any regulation put in place for hunting should have a basis in either one or the other.  Things like a 1:00 closure or shooting one gobbler a day, or in the first week, or whatever, fundamentally just fall under the ethics category.  They are not biological concerns.   

Ultimately then, those regulations fall under the "who wants what the most?" category more than anything else.  If the majority of Missouri turkey hunters are satisfied with the existing regulations, then so be it.  But if anybody is trying to justify those regulations based on biological reasons, they would be in error. 

Social reasons are another matter altogether.  If there are enough mushroom hunters in Missouri to create a need to give separate time periods to "hunters" and "gatherers", then that obviously is a consideration that must be addressed.  Once again, though, if the MDC is setting those regulations based on any sort of biological justification, they are doing so wrongly. 

As one who has hunted a number of states, some of which have early daily closures, I find it to be an unnecessary nuisance to not be able to hunt in the afternoon.  I make the best of it by trying to locate new places to hunt, make contacts, and pattern birds,...but all the while I am asking myself, "why is this state not allowing people to hunt in the afternoon?"   Whatever, the justification,  it is what it is,...and we just go with the flow.

[larry9988]

I live in Georgia and we can hunt all day, and I am very thankful. I can say with out a doubt that 90% of the turkeys I have killed have been in the afternoon. I am a school teacher and hunt almost entirely after I get off work. I hunt on Saturday mornings, but it's kind of a crap shoot when it comes to the weather. I probably would just give up turkey hunting if it were not for the afternoon hunting. Is this the best way to hunt? I am not sure, but when it's the best game in town , you play it then, or you don't play at all.

[stinkpickle]

I live in Georgia and we can hunt all day, and I am very thankful. I can say with out a doubt that 90% of the turkeys I have killed have been in the afternoon. I am a school teacher and hunt almost entirely after I get off work. I hunt on Saturday mornings, but it's kind of a crap shoot when it comes to the weather. I probably would just give up turkey hunting if it were not for the afternoon hunting. Is this the best way to hunt? I am not sure, but when it's the best game in town , you play it then, or you don't play at all.

That's exactly why I was able to hunt turkey a LOT more in the fall back in high school...because Missouri allowed it during the fall season.

[LI Outdoorsman]

Speaking of ethical..there are some who feel that the only "ethical" time to kill a turkey is right after flydown or sometime after leaving the roost. Shooting a bird in the late afternoon on his way BACK to the roost is somehow unethical or "cheating" or not "right"..What is the difference really?..Like I said before a tag filled equals less pressure in the woods the next day..I say as long as its done according to the local rules its all good with me..

[stinkpickle]

...Like I said before a tag filled equals less pressure in the woods the next day...

Hey now!  There's no place for logic and reason in this thread. 

On ethics, I knew a landowner back in my high school days that thought it was unethical to shoot toms in the spring, since all they were trying to do was "get some".  He thought that was just plain mean and unfair.  LOL! 

[owlhoot]

[quote author=I-55Bandit link=topic0+ years. 

I have walked away from quite a few working gobblers at the 1:00 pm cut off.  Just adds to the experience of it all.  I like that they offer a youth weekend, but would be in favor of being allowed another the first week.  Early bow season....leave that for KS and bow hunt during the fall or regular spring season if choose to do so.

Good question  "why change or mess with something that already works very well".  And here is the worst part about changes. Once a change has been made more liberal towards hunting it is almost impossible to make it go back.

you think that would happen? They took the Doe  season limits down significantly when they felt that the population was being affected.

[owlhoot]

I personally like the 1 p.m. closure and the 1 bird first week rule, keep the nonresidents going to KS and NE 

Don't think the 1 o'clock closure is working to keep nonresidence out of Missouri. Or the one bird first week either they still seem to flock here. I wonder what the numbers are for nonresident turkey hunters compared to Kansas and Nebraska with there all day hunts and longer seasons? I know around Truman like this opening day I wasn't sure what state I was in from all the nonresident license plates , I guess state of shock! Lol

[El Pavo Grande]

I personally like the 1 p.m. closure and the 1 bird first week rule, keep the nonresidents going to KS and NE 

Don't think the 1 o'clock closure is working to keep nonresidence out of Missouri. Or the one bird first week either they still seem to flock here. I wonder what the numbers are for nonresident turkey hunters compared to Kansas and Nebraska with there all day hunts and longer seasons? I know around Truman like this opening day I wasn't sure what state I was in from all the nonresident license plates , I guess state of shock! Lol

I have a lot of experience hunting all 3 you mention and in my opinion KS sees more out of state hunters than the other two, at least the areas I have hunted.  Everybody and their brother hunts KS now.  I think 15 years ago MO was the top destination, but KS has been the new fad over the last 10 years.  For numerous reasons....easier to kill more turkeys consistently, all day hunting,  two per day limit.  Though I am sure the border areas can vary. 

Trust me as a resident of MO, I would NOT want all day hunting and more than one turkey the first week.  It will attract a whole lot more out of state hunters.  I hear multiple people discuss those as negatives.  Be careful what you wish for!!!

[drenalinld]

It was MO, then KS and more recently NE the "hot" spot for out of state hunters. Yay internet and social media.

IMO what MO has done has worked so why change it. However, I am convinced that gobbler harvest has little effect on turkey populations so I am not sure changing it up will hurt the population. I know this, when I hunted MO 20 years ago, we would take guns to the motel room and then drive around and hear gobblers all afternoon!

[El Pavo Grande]

It was MO, then KS and more recently NE the "hot" spot for out of state hunters. Yay internet and social media.

IMO what MO has done has worked so why change it. However, I am convinced that gobbler harvest has little effect on turkey populations so I am not sure changing it up will hurt the population. I know this, when I hunted MO 20 years ago, we would take guns to the motel room and then drive around and hear gobblers all afternoon!

I agree.  I live north of the river from you and grew up in your county.  It surprises me the people that will not hunt here at home, but will travel to KS or NE to hunt, then plaster the exploits all over Facebook.  To each his own I guess.

[owlhoot]

I personally like the 1 p.m. closure and the 1 bird first week rule, keep the nonresidents going to KS and NE 

Don't think the 1 o'clock closure is working to keep nonresidence out of Missouri. Or the one bird first week either they still seem to flock here. I wonder what the numbers are for nonresident turkey hunters compared to Kansas and Nebraska with there all day hunts and longer seasons? I know around Truman like this opening day I wasn't sure what state I was in from all the nonresident license plates , I guess state of shock! Lol

I have a lot of experience hunting all 3 you mention and in my opinion KS sees more out of state hunters than the other two, at least the areas I have hunted.  Everybody and their brother hunts KS now.  I think 15 years ago MO was the top destination, but KS has been the new fad over the last 10 years.  For numerous reasons....easier to kill more turkeys consistently, all day hunting,  two per day limit.  Though I am sure the border areas can vary. 

Trust me as a resident of MO, I would NOT want all day hunting and more than one turkey the first week.  It will attract a whole lot more out of state hunters.  I hear multiple people discuss those as negatives.  Be careful what you wish for!!!

Been 7 years or more since hunting KS . I know I sure liked it because of all the walk-in with nobody on it . Between 2000 -2008 anyway when I hunted there the landowners granted permission without much fuss . So things must really be changing .The only packed areas were in N. East counties were Missouri and Iowa hunters flocked . It was a refreshing change from MO hunting with too many hunters. There are too many resident and non-resident hunters  in Mo and there has been too many for years now . So I would agree that any regulations to bring more in the game would not help.

[owlhoot]

It was MO, then KS and more recently NE the "hot" spot for out of state hunters. Yay internet and social media.

IMO what MO has done has worked so why change it. However, I am convinced that gobbler harvest has little effect on turkey populations so I am not sure changing it up will hurt the population. I know this, when I hunted MO 20 years ago, we would take guns to the motel room and then drive around and hear gobblers all afternoon!

Yeah but the population has definitely changed now. There are a fraction of a gobblers compared to 20 years ago

[stinkpickle]

... I know this, when I hunted MO 20 years ago, we would take guns to the motel room and then drive around and hear gobblers all afternoon!

It's been almost 20 years since I heard that, too. 

[Hooksfan]

I moved to Missouri about 18 years ago. Honestly,  even in the years when the population plummeted, there were still plenty of gobblers for hunters whose tactics were aggressively going after the birds.
I hear folks attest how many birds were around in the 80's and I can only imagine what that was like.  One thing I am fairly certain about is that hunting was not responsible for the plummet. Folks who know more than I do about biology say it is part of the normal population cycle and that we will likely never reach those numbers again.
My argument is that if conservative regulations didn't preserve Missouri turkey numbers and it is accepted that more liberal regs will not have a discernable impact, then why not make some changes?
Seems like the MDC is more interested in managing people than they are managing wildlife, IMO.
I also find it interesting to see Missouri residents complaining about the nonresident pressure and speak of their own exploits in Kansas and Nebraska in the same breath. Sorry, but "I don't want someone else to kill MY turkeys" isn't a sound biological argument.
I would be for liberalized limits, all day hunting and a week long archery season AFTER the regular season.

[stinkpickle]

Yeah, it's amazing what four or five consecutive years of spring flooding will do.