Pattern is too TIGHT

[TrackeySauresRex]

 Dave
I try and keep it simple as possible. My pattern I look at the 10",and look to see if it's nice and even. Good job keeping it at 40! This is a great guid from OG to go by. The LB's hold real tight. Personally not my type of shell. JMO 


http://oldgobbler.com/Forum/index.php/topic,17657.0.html

[Onpoint]

  It seems that everyone on this forum is looking to shoot a pattern with all of their sot in a 10 inch circle at 50 yds.  This season I shot a Benelli M2 with an Indian Creek choke that put 225 shot in a 10 inch circle at 40 measured yds. The problem is that as season wears on the foliage gets quite a bit thicker and your shots are a lot closer.  I am looking to start over with this gun and see if I can come up with a combo that will shoot a nice even pattern in a 26 to 30 inch circle at 40 yds.  This should than be a good killer at 25 to 30 later in the season and still be very efficient at 40 yds.  Anyone else out there who agrees with me, and what are you shooting.   Thanks, Dave

I think 26 is too much shot spread out.

I like a combo that shoots an even 125-140 in the 10

x2  And that usually gets good out to the 20" or so,  much more than that and get pretty sparse.  Of course i don't shoot heavy 3 1/2 shells or heavy shot charges with small shot so only dealing with 350 pieces or less.   
By the way what load are you shooting?

in my beretta i shoot federal 3rd degree and in my mossberg I shoot winchester HV 4's.

[kdsberman]

I dont see the need for 20" of error. 10 seems like alot of room to play.
I mean I actually aim when I shoot. I dont shoot at running birds so considering all of the other hunting I do is a single projectile why the need for so much error. I can probably go to a slug and still get most of my birds. I mean we can all shoot beer cans all day with a 22 and when it comes to turkeys we become a lousy shot.

This.

Well said.  Me personally, I dont shoot a bird unless his head is up or mostly up and not moving.  AND within 40 yards.  If its at 41 yards, he walks.

[cluck]

1. Beer cans don't move, turkey's  head does, a lot! 2. Turkey won't wait for me to turn on my ff3 if he's very close. 3. There does not seem to be the perfect turkey shotgun! Where did good hunting skills go?   Cluck   

[Onpoint]

I dont see the need for 20" of error. 10 seems like alot of room to play.
I mean I actually aim when I shoot. I dont shoot at running birds so considering all of the other hunting I do is a single projectile why the need for so much error. I can probably go to a slug and still get most of my birds. I mean we can all shoot beer cans all day with a 22 and when it comes to turkeys we become a lousy shot.

100 pellets evenly spaced In the 10 ar 40 will kill any turkey known to man.

Turkeys have relatively small vitals, often times poor, uncomfortsble set ups, tired arms from holding the gun up forever, and the bastards often times don't take the path they're "supposed".

For me and my style of hunting a more even 15" pattern and less center dense pattern is better. But I will also take shots some folks wouldn't. I shoot just as many walkin As I do that have their neck stretched out. Never had A problem shooting A walking turkey. If I have a good clean shot I'll pop one as he's running off and ill blast em out of the sky too.

I don't take 50 yard shots though and most of my shots are within 30 yards.

If I hunted fields all the time where a further shot was the norm I'd shoot a tighter patterning setup. I actually have have a gun setup for this purpose. It's a 535 that'll put 200 5's in the 10. 3.5" winchester HV 4's have the same POI in this gun and it's what I loaded up with every time I packed thst gun this season. If my wife packs that gun she prefers the tighter pattern.

the first year i set up a super  tight patterning gun was about about 15 years ago when I was still in high school. Nitro and rhino where the hottest thing smokin then. Missed 3 public land birds in one day. Went back to my Remington 675 hevi shot choke and Remington hevi shot 6's and filled all 5 of my tags with no more misses that year.

[mikejd]

I you really want to have some fun and get good. Go shoot some clays with your turkey choke in your gun.

If you make a direct hit the clay will disappear right before your eyes.

[natman]

Aiming is not the issue, I have a Burris Fast Fire iii on the gun. I guess the turkeys where some of the repliers hunt stand real still while they get shot.  The turkeys here in Pa. tend to try everything possible to keep their beards in tack. If a bird moves while you are pulling the trigger and you have a 10" pattern you might edge him and cripple him.  If you have a 20" pattern you will still get a fatal hit.  If you take the pellets that I am getting in a 10" circle and spread them evening over a 20" pattern you still have a very lethal pattern.  Just My Opinion.

The birds don't hold still while I shoot - I shoot while they're holding still.

Usually because I've given a tiny yelp to get them to stop and gobble. I fire when their head is outstretched.

I shoot for the middle of the neck. The bird would have to move his head almost a foot to get out of the pattern. Hasn't happened yet.

If you use a more open choke to get an open pattern, then at 40 yards it will be less dense and full of holes. A bad trade IMO.

[BandedSpur]

[quote author=natman link=topic=56658.msg561230#msg561230 date=143369298

I shoot for the middle of the neck. The bird would have to move his head almost a foot to get out of the pattern. Hasn't happened yet.
[/quote]

It will

[natman]

[quote author=natman link=topic=56658.msg561230#msg561230 date=143369298

I shoot for the middle of the neck. The bird would have to move his head almost a foot to get out of the pattern. Hasn't happened yet.

It will
[/quote]

Perhaps, but my assessment is that the odds of that happening are a lot less than of wounding a turkey at 40 yards because I used a choke that gave a 20" sweet spot.

[mikejd]

[quote author=natman link=topic=56658.msg561230#msg561230 date=143369298

I shoot for the middle of the neck. The bird would have to move his head almost a foot to get out of the pattern. Hasn't happened yet.

It will

Perhaps, but my assessment is that the odds of that happening are a lot less than of wounding a turkey at 40 yards because I used a choke that gave a 20" sweet spot.
[/quote]

I totally agree. There is no way a turkeys head is moving out of the way of a good 10" pattern. Back before all of these great chokes and ammo they used to say as long as you have 6 hits in the vitals shooting at a turkey head target you were good for turkeys. Thats about 50 hits in a 10" circle. We didnt miss back then either.

[Roost 1]

No such thing as too tight of pattern to me... Of course, I don't try to shoot a bead or rifle sights either..
Need good quality optics when shooting tight patterns.. Then use a little discretion and discipline when actually shooting at birds.... They deserve it!!!!!

[natman]

The area of a circle increases with the square of the radius. Therefore a 20" circle with twice the radius of a 10" circle will have 4 times the area. You only have so many pellets, so if you want to spread them out evenly over 4 times as much area you would have to make do with only 1/4 as many pellets in any given spot. Changing from 100 pellets to 25 pellets in a 10" sweet spot seems like a bad trade.

Worrying about the turkey moving is easily dealt with - pick your shot when the turkey isn't moving. The other possible causes for missing are poor sights or poor marksmanship. Either issue should be dealt with directly. Trying to bandaid over them with a wider pattern is a bad choice.

[howl]

I wish I'd read this thread before I killed all those turkeys with a .695 and no sights. Now I don't know what I'll do for goose season. I guess I need a punt gun and some kind of heads up display off a fighter jet? 'Cause, you know, those geese are flying.

[Longshanks]

I don't mind 10" patterns. The only problem is when I have a 10" pattern at 40yds and a baseball size pattern at 20yds. I shoot most turkey's inside 30yds no matter what gun I hunt with.  A good 10" at 20yds and a good 15"-20" pattern at 40 seems to be the best set up for me hunting in the timber. High numbers in a 10" can still be turned with these patterns. I'm hunting with a Beretta Xtrema turning 330's in a 10" at 40yds. Hevi 13 3.5/2.25/7's.  10" pattern at 20-25 and 15"-20" at 40.  Shooting any tighter patterns just increases my chances of missing..and we all miss from time to time.

*never have considered a pattern too tight until Winchester Longbeards came along.

[Shoebuck]

You are spot on Longhanks. That is what I am looking for.  I am going to have to try something other than then Long Beards, Nothing against them, they are an really good load  -  Just a little tight.  I do not like spending the extra for the hevi shot but I guess I will need to give them a go.   Thanks all,   Dave