Shooting Jakes ??

[Tommy Strutsalot]

I do not intend to shoot Jakes but as others have said, I've been fooled twice.  One time was last spring.  It was late morning and I fired one up deep in a wood block and he just came running.  Never strutted but I saw this beard swinging and was certain it was longbeard.  I didn't know until I went to check out his spurs.  Beard was 7.5"



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[g8rvet]

Looks just like the super jake my nephew killed.  His was 6.5" but it was real thick how he came in and we both saw beard.

[GobbleNut]

Generally speaking, I have no problem with anybody shooting a jake...even though I personally will not.  I will eat a tag every time, even if it is the last minute of the last day of the season.  Shooting a turkey to say I filled a tag just isn't that important to me anymore. 

Having said that, what should be of importance to all of us is understanding the impact of shooting jakes is in the specific location we are doing it.  The recurring theme across the turkey hunting spectrum is the idea that some places are experiencing sharp declines in their turkey populations.  Those declines are almost exclusively due to reproductive failure...which results in little or no population recruitment over time. 

In those specific circumstances, the survival of a jake (the rare male turkey that survived to adulthood) may be of more consequence than in others.  More importantly, having numerous hunters shooting jakes in those situations can potentially have a real impact in a declining turkey population's ability to recover if and when favorable conditions for successful reproduction/recruitment occur. 

Now, admittedly, the circumstances that fit the above scenario may be rare, but my personal perspective is one of asking the question,..."Is the jake I am about to shoot one that will live to breed some hens next spring resulting in a successful bunch of poults living to adulthood and impacting future turkey numbers here?"  Perhaps the answer is "no", but for me, I am going to be an optimist and say "let's take a chance on it and let this jake live".   

...If I really need to eat turkey that badly, I will go down to the local supermarket and buy one.  ...It is a lot cheaper to do that anyway...   

[Paulmyr]

Recently on the wild turkey science podcast they talked about this thing called the turkey brotherhood. In this brotherhood siblings work together to establish territories and display to females with the dominant sibling getting breeding rights.  If remember correctly, I heard that hens prefer this. Interesting episode.

This episode has me thinking these harassing bands of Jake's are setting themselves up to take over the hierarchy.

[Turkeyman]

Generally speaking, I have no problem with anybody shooting a jake...even though I personally will not.  I will eat a tag every time, even if it is the last minute of the last day of the season.  Shooting a turkey to say I filled a tag just isn't that important to me anymore.

When I started turkey hunting many years ago I shot jakes. Nowadays I feel the same way, although in the last several years I'll admit I've shot a jake in mistake.

[ChesterCopperpot]

Had one last year last day of season that played the game too beautifully to pass. Gobbled, strutted, did everything you could ask for in a bird to hunt. He went home with me.


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[Turkeyman]

I hear you! Back around 1980 or so on the last day of our NY season Memorial weekend I was taking the family down to PA to visit my parents. I made sure we left early so I could try one last time where I knew there was bird. Well...as luck would have it I called him in. A gobbling, strutting and pirouetting big jake. Without a doubt the "boss". He made the trip to my parent's place with me. Honestly, although that long ago, I think that's the last bird I've seen pirouette.

[Turkeyman]

To those of you that have never seen a bird pirouette...you may never. The difference between more naive birds in the past and pressured birds now.

[eggshell]

Jake survival may be the most impacted part of reduced bag limits. I know since Ohio went to 1 gobbler bag limit very few jakes are being shot. Before hunters would take an early season jake and then hunt longbeards. Now they hold out for the long beard. I know this is happening because i hear a lot of guys talking about it and I have seen it in the local hunters. As for me, I may still shoot a Jake, but I'm just going to say it was a mistake. JUst having fun guys, I'm not picking on anyone.

I rarely disagree with Gobblenut, but store bought turkey is no ways near as good as wild and I had way more fun acquiring the wild one, even a Jake.

As I've said I generally pass Jakes, but I am not going to say I will never shoot one. Last year I passed up 19 different jakes, some multiple times. With that many on the farms I hunted I doubt very seriously shooting one would have changed the breeding dynamics. I would guess there has not been a jake harvested off those farms in years. Maybe that's why there is a strong population on them, but these farms have the best turkey habitat you will find anywhere in this state. My belief is Jakes are fair game in a healthy flock, but in a depressed and stressed flock, protect them. Like it's been said many times, Habitat, Habitat and after that more Habitat. Outside of habitat only disease will reduce birds. Even predators aren't effective in good habitat. Many nest are preyed upon because hens are forced into poor nesting sites.

[sbbow]

To each his own. Shoot what you want as long as it's legal.

^^^
THIS
TO MANY PEOPLE WORRY ABOUT WHAT EVERYONE THINKS!

BE YOURSELF!!


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[quavers59]

   Sure. Definitely  in the Fall. Spring also sometimes.

[countryboy3006]

I shot jakes when I was first starting to turkey hunt and I shot one a couple years ago when I had my daughter sitting in a blind with me.  Usually I don't shoot them even if it is the last day and I still have a tag.  Just the way I do it but I don't have a problem if someone else wants to shoot them.

[G squared 23]

I am not a serious turkey hunter, I go 3 days a year and I want to get one.  No $12 shells or special chairs, I sit on a bucket. Properties I have to hunt are super limited and I'm not skilled or driven enough to hunt public. I'm probably the average turkey hunter.

I put a lot more effort into deer hunting, I would never shoot a small buck, so I can understand the elitist.  The only difference is that all turkeys look exactly the same, and no two whitetail racks (of any size) are the same.

[Tom007]

I do not intend to shoot Jakes but as others have said, I've been fooled twice.  One time was last spring.  It was late morning and I fired one up deep in a wood block and he just came running.  Never strutted but I saw this beard swinging and was certain it was longbeard.  I didn't know until I went to check out his spurs.  Beard was 7.5"



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That sure looks like a Tom to me......

[NOmad]

Most Jakes don't survive until the second year, and not only that but Jakes do no breeding. If they do, they aren't fertile. So realistically, killing a Jake has zero impact on the population, where as killing a breeding gobbler during breeding season does. I'm not above shooting a Jake, and if he comes in gobbling, he's taking a ride in my truck. I don't discriminate. I get very few days to hunt anymore and it's what I dream about every day, at least once a hour, all year long.

Here is a scenario that is very likely to happen in my life


After working 36 days straight, I get a day off, I have no clue when I might get my next one, I found a piece of public that surprisingly doesn't have 10 trucks at it, I am in god's creation, watching the spring woods wake up, feeling the cold morning air, hearing whipoor wills, and the little birds, a turkey gobbles, on the mountain, I climb 1,300 feet straight up, I respond, he gobbles again, closer, I respond, he goes silent. My heart is in my throat, my palms are sweating, I have no clue how everything can't hear my heart beating, 5 minutes later a red head pops up and he has a 4 or 5" beard, long legs, a Jake. I've played the game, I've won, and I'm pulling the trigger. It makes no difference to me if he has button spurs and a 4" beard or 1 1/2" spurs and a 11" beard. Once I get home, the kids ohh and aww over it a little, we take a picture and then the spurs and beard go in a box with the rest of them. The real trophy was the experience and that fine eating you can't get elsewhere.


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This is actually fals.  The Mississippi study conducted on jake mortality was only 6%.  Effectively 94% of jakes made it to their second year of life.

To add to that, most recently Chamberlain recently released a study where 85% of gobblers in UNHUNTED populations survived annually.

Point being, male turkey mortality is most significantly influence by HUNTING.

How you view success and what you're looking for out of a hunt is certainly your personal prerogative but justifying killing a jake due to low survivability just isn't a thing.

As far as male turkey mortality, it's absolutely no secret that the most are killed by hunting. They have very few predators that will get them other than a hunter. My point is, why is shooting a Jake frowned upon?. You can't manage turkey like deer. You're pissing in the wind to try. You can't stock pile them and you can't expect the turkey you see today to be there next season. As far as a Jake vs a 2 year old gobbler. What is the difference other than 3" of beard and 1/4" of spur?. A two year old is no more wary than a Jake but hunters love em and some how it's more socially acceptable to shoot them?. I'd rather see someone shoot a Jake than reap a gobbler, shoot him at extended range, or decoy one in. But, if it's legal, knock yourself out. I hunt for me, not to be accepted in the "in crowd".


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I just don't see how you can say killing a Jake has NO effect on the population. Yeah, maybe not immediately but the way I look at it is their life can go two directions. 1) They make it to their 2nd year of life and begin breeding or 2) they do not make it to their 2nd year of life and do not begin breeding. When you shoot a Jake, you are guaranteeing that route number 1 never even gets a chance to occur.