I'm sure this topic has been tossed about, but I am curious to see what folks would say would be the toughest general area in the nation to be successful turkey hunting? I have hunted nine different states over a thirty year span from South Dakota to Louisiana and I am convinced the toughest birds are located in the Florida Parishes of Southeast Louisiana where I grew up. I would also argue that those birds have more characteristics in common with the Osceola than they do the Eastern, but that's a whole separate debate.
What say all of you?
In the states that I've hunted turkey, I believe public ground turkeys in MO are the most difficult. These are the states that I've hunted and shot toms; MI, OH, IN, MO, SD and KS.
:smiley-patriotic-flagwaver-an
Where I hunt!!!!!!!!!!
Florida Parishes near Chipola, La.
I've only hunted easterns in three different states. NJ,Pa,NY.. I would say NY birds have been the toughest for me.
mountain gobblers on big ridges and hollows in WV!! I have only hunted a few places so mine is not a good judge, i was just throwing out that mountain gobblers are some of the toughest birds to hunt and kill, they arent dumb lol
Southeastern gobblers. If you can kill them here you can kill them anywhere
Alaska!
I have only hunted turkeys in WV but i read where only 5 percent success rate in Florida so i would have to say Florida.
Quote from: Grobec1 on June 06, 2012, 02:08:03 PM
Where I hunt!!!!!!!!!!
Florida Parishes near Chipola, La.
Well if u know where Montpelier is, then you know my home town. Family place is on the Tickfaw River.
Quote from: Hooksfan on June 06, 2012, 02:46:30 PM
Quote from: Grobec1 on June 06, 2012, 02:08:03 PM
Where I hunt!!!!!!!!!!
Florida Parishes near Chipola, La.
Well if u know where Montpelier is, then you know my home town. Family place is on the Tickfaw River.
Know exactly where it is. Stop by Dykes Feed Store on the way to my camp a lot. Also have been to Bear Creek steak house a few times.
Quote from: slickyboyboo on June 06, 2012, 03:13:09 PM
A quote from Preston Pittman that I think sums it up in a nutshell! I've heard him say this many times in several of his seminar presentations, and many times in just personal conservation between he and I.
"If you can kill a turkey in Mississippi, Louisiana or Alabama, you can kill one anywhere."
+1
I have killed them in AL, FL, MS, and GA - I have killed some that I made look stupid and I have chased one bird all day for five days straight, roost him every evening and be with him at flydown and not kill him!
I am going after Rio's and Merriams next year so I hope to have a beter feel for it, but I do believe it is the hardest in the SE!
I have killed turkeys in several states and to me the toughest are the public land birds in Mississippi.
Inside the city limits! :funnyturkey:
I've only hunted them in MS, AL, and LA. Can say there is not a darn bit of difference between them, at least that I've noticed. I can tell you with no degree of uncertainty that it easier on ground with lots of birds than ground with very few. Been fortunate enough to hunt great ground and it's so much better than the very good ground I have now. Poor ground with very few birds will make any sane man take up golf.
I can't really say that any are tougher in any given area I've hunted, private or public. About the only thing I can say is it's a good thing me and a couple of my buddy's don't live in Ne.
Turkey's are as hard to kill as people make them.
I know what you mean about Nebraska. :angel9:
I have killed turkeys in 15 states from FL to SD. I have to say that the hardest turkeys to hunt are the turkeys that are hunted the hardest. I think thats why alot of people would say AL, MS,FL etc... Because those states are hunted the hardest by some of the best turkey killers in the world. Dumb turkeys in those states don't get to pass on many dumb genes. That said if you can find some turkeys in those states that are not hunted very hard they would be easier to kill, I did not say easy to kill. I know most turkey hunters would say that the Rio and Merriams are easy turkeys to kill but I can put some very good turkey hunters on some turkeys in NM, and AZ, where the turkeys are hunted pretty hard, that would have a hard time killing turkeys. I didn't say they couldn't kill one but it wouldn't be easy. I believe that a turkey is a turkey. If you push him and hunt him hard he will be hard to kill and it doesn't matter where he lives.
TRKYHTR
Quote from: TRKYHTR on June 06, 2012, 05:26:54 PM
I believe that a turkey is a turkey. If you push him and hunt him hard he will be hard to kill and it doesn't matter where he lives.
TRKYHTR
I gotta agree with Joe on this one. I don't have a lot of experience hunting turkeys outside of California but the public land places I hunt in California are tough places to kill birds. Mainly because the turkeys are pressured hard daily by folks who like to chase them. These birds learn very quickly to go silent and are very difficult to pattern.
My brother moved to Iowa a few years back after hunting since the mid 80's in California. While Easterns are generally tougher to hunt than our Rio's in CA, the amount of good public land that holds turkeys in IA compared to public land in California makes tagging out much easier in his opinion. He has put two toms down every year without a problem and even goes over to MO to get another bird. What he has found is most of those States hold birds throughout the States whereas in CA the turkeys are spread out more into specific areas. Most of those areas are private so NF and BLM lands are usually crowded at the elevations where the turkeys reside in CA.
Any place can be tough if turkey are constantly molested. I've seen good private grounds turn into really tough places to hunt as soon as permission is granted and birds start getting hunted.
Kevin
My opinion- a turkey is a turkey, no matter what state he lives in. There are things that make them tougher, terrain and hunting pressure being the most common. A turkey that lives on heavily hunted land will be much tougher than one on strictly managed private land, no matter which state you are in. A heavily hunted bird in the Northeast will likely be harder to kill than an Alabama bird on land that sees little to no hunting pressure, and vice versa.
Some states obviously have more hunters than others (like many in the southeastern USA), which in turn creates more pressure on more land. You can hunt unpressured land in those same states though, and hunt birds that act totally different. But the same is true in states like NY or WI, and there are plenty of areas in every state that have hard hunted land which results in difficult birds. To say that birds are harder to kill in your state is just ignorant IMO.
The difficulty of the turkeys you hunt depends not on the state (turkeys know no political boundaries), but on the terrain they inhabit and the hunting pressure they recieve. A good turkey killer will adapt and put birds on the ground anywhere, while a poor hunter will probably struggle anywhere.
I know gobblers in Pennsylvania can be very tough to bring to bag! Lots of hunting pressure here.
I have hunted in WV, VA, NC, SC, GA, FL, AL, KY, and TX. The toughest places to get on gobblers and call them in and kill them for me is Mingo Co. WV, and Bath Co. and Highland Co. VA. If you can kill gobblers in these places you can kill them anywhere. Gobblers are very wild natured everywhere but seems to me that gobblers in Bath Co. VA are the smartest and wildest turkeys in the world. Along the Bluestone and New River here at home in Mercer and Summers CO. is running a close 2nd in tough places to kill gobblers, but I don't care how tough a place is to hunt if there are gobblers in it I will hunt them.
:OGturkeyhead: :OGturkeyhead:
I'll join in with the vain of thought that a conditioned turkey makes for a tough turkey, wherever he is. That being said, I'll put a properly conditioned Alabama turkey up against any takers. But I killed a public land Kentucky gobbler this May that could certainly hold is own.
Quote from: WildTigerTrout on June 06, 2012, 06:28:01 PM
I know gobblers in Pennsylvania can be very tough to bring to bag! Lots of hunting pressure here.
I''ll second that :icon_thumright:
I have set here and read everyones post about tough gobblers. Looks to me like anywhere you hunt them they are tough. OLD GOBBLERS are smart anywhere you hunt them, I can see that from everyones post. Glad to see that I am not the only one that thinks gobblers are tough. Keep posting guys I like to read what everyone thinks about how tough they are where ever you hunt.
In my humble opinion you have not hunted a hard to kill turkey until you come south to the Florida everglades and hunt the Everglades Oseola.Find one is a major task Killing him is a even harder task.They have to survive the swamp as poults which is full of Pythons hungry for anything that moves,Florida Panther ,Bobcat ,numerous hawks and eagles,not to mention High water and very little to forge on every thing they eat here is natural there are not crops growing in the everglades. They are killed ever year but they are by far the hardest I have ever hunted. Put an Everglades turkey hunt on yer bucket list ,I promise you it will be a memorable experience.
Quote from: WildTigerTrout on June 06, 2012, 06:28:01 PM
I know gobblers in Pennsylvania can be very tough to bring to bag! Lots of hunting pressure here.
yea,no kidding.plus the 6-7 hen's that are still with them as of today,unreal.
Anywhere that I go hunting :TooFunny:
I live and hunt the Florida parishes of La. I have killed turkey in : Ms, La, Tx, Ks and Mo. I would have to say public land in sw Ms is the hardest place with the florida parishes coming in a close second.
I would say that a mountain bird anywhere in the Appalachian mountains are pretty tough. You better be in shape.
AR...it's hard to kill them if they arn't there.
Out of the 13 states I've tagged legs in, I have to say that Merriam's on the Pine Ridge rank hardest for me. But for states in general, Florida takes the cake.
I agree with TeocTom!! Lately it seems like every timber or field i walk into has the hardest bird to tag!! :lol:
There is a whole lot of the country that I haven't hunted but so far, it appears that the public land Osceola may be the toughest.
Although our own Hookspur, who is a turkey killing machine, once told me LA was one tough spot to get a bird.
hunted birds in 8 different states I believe kills total 143 as of this spring. I have the least success @ home here in Schuylkill co Pa, Bird don't gobble anymore.
I used to think that public land Osceolas were the hardest to kill. But that was before I started hunting Easterns. I've found that Easterns have been the most challenging bird I've hunted, and they don't seem to be any harder or easier no matter where I go.
Quote from: lonnie sneed jr. on June 06, 2012, 08:02:59 PM
I have hunted in WV, VA, NC, SC, GA, FL, AL, KY, and TX. The toughest places to get on gobblers and call them in and kill them for me is Mingo Co. WV, and Bath Co. and Highland Co. VA. If you can kill gobblers in these places you can kill them anywhere. Gobblers are very wild natured everywhere but seems to me that gobblers in Bath Co. VA are the smartest and wildest turkeys in the world. Along the Bluestone and New River here at home in Mercer and Summers CO. is running a close 2nd in tough places to kill gobblers, but I don't care how tough a place is to hunt if there are gobblers in it I will hunt them.
:OGturkeyhead: :OGturkeyhead:
Interesting point about Bath Co., VA. In the National Forest, I would say once you are above them and on the same ridge, the game is over. I'm not sure if you've ever had the opportunity to run down South to chase turkeys, but they will change your perception on the difficulty of the mountain turkey. I think the most difficult part about pursuing those national forest birds is simply getting up the mountain to them.
The game is never over until you pull the trigger and get your hands on the gobbler. I have hunted the southern gobblers, only FL gomes close in the states I have hunted.
:OGturkeyhead: :OGturkeyhead:
Quote from: JohnDoe on June 07, 2012, 03:02:01 PM
Quote from: wingbonehntr on June 06, 2012, 09:50:41 PM
I live and hunt the Florida parishes of La. I have killed turkey in : Ms, La, Tx, Ks and Mo. I would have to say public land in sw Ms is the hardest place with the florida parishes coming in a close second.
What the heck are the Florida Parrishes of La.
John
They are the parishes in La that lie East of the MS river... They were not part of the original La Purchase and were part of West Florida. There are 8 parishes, and they are basically between Lake Ponchartrain and MS.
I hunt in North La. I've hunted in La, Tx, MS, AL, MO, NE, KS. I'd have to say MS or La public are the hardest, for the reasons everyone has already mentioned
Quote from: honker22 on June 07, 2012, 04:09:07 PM
Quote from: JohnDoe on June 07, 2012, 03:02:01 PM
Quote from: wingbonehntr on June 06, 2012, 09:50:41 PM
I live and hunt the Florida parishes of La. I have killed turkey in : Ms, La, Tx, Ks and Mo. I would have to say public land in sw Ms is the hardest place with the florida parishes coming in a close second.
What the heck are the Florida Parrishes of La.
John
They are the parishes in La that lie East of the MS river... They were not part of the original La Purchase and were part of West Florida. There are 8 parishes, and they are basically between Lake Ponchartrain and MS.
I hunt in North La. I've hunted in La, Tx, MS, AL, MO, NE, KS. I'd have to say MS or La public are the hardest, for the reasons everyone has already mentioned
Honker is right. I'll add a history teachers lesson here--Sorry can't help it. At one time Spanish Florida extended all the way to the Mississippi River. Under the terms of the Adams-Onis Treaty, the US acquired Florida and the boundaries were changed over time as new states were added. But if you look at the northern border of Louisiana east of the Mississippi River, you will notice it is the exact same latitude of the northern border of Florida--Thats because that line extended all the way to the Mississippi River as the old border of Spanish Florida.---Hence the name Florida Parishes for those Parishes (counties) in Louisiana east of the Mississippi River.
Gulf coastal plain and ouachita mountains in AR. Tons of pressure plus few birds makes it very tough. I've hunted plenty of other states and only MS and AL can come close to comparing.
Quote from: TRKYHTR on June 06, 2012, 05:26:54 PM
I believe that a turkey is a turkey. If you push him and hunt him hard he will be hard to kill and it doesn't matter where he lives.
TRKYHTR
Well played, even the dumb ones get tough after being ran off a few times.
Ask me how I know.
My observations, which coincidentally seem to mirror a lot of others that have posted on this subject...
>>>Generally speaking, the harder a turkey has been hunted, both in the short term and in the long term, the harder he will be to call and kill, regardless of the subspecies.
>>>The more a hunter is willing to use "non-traditional" tactics to kill a turkey, the more likely he is to kill a turkey under any circumstances.
>>>All other factors being equal, the Eastern/Osceola subspecies are more difficult to kill than the Merriams/Rio subspecies.
>>>All of the subspecies can be ridiculously easy to kill or excrutiatingly difficult to kill when the circumstances are right,...or wrong.
From the Sofa :goofball:
Everyone has made several very good points! Two factors that I feel influence turkey hunting more than anything are....
1. Hunting Preasure
2. Hen Harvest
If you go off of these two factors alone all should point to the deep south. Granted I have not yet had the opportunity to hunt the deep south but statistics alone support. I have hunted turkeys in NY, MD, VA, WV, NE, WY, and NH and I will have to agree with featheredhat that the physical demands of killing a turkey in the mountains of WV, VA, and Western MD is the getting up the hill. Once you get on the turkeys level it is Game Over!
P.S- Nobody really knows where the hardest place to kill a gobbler is. But, I can assure you that everyone knows the easiet place to kill a gobbler is. Thank you Nebraska!
All dependent on turkey populations,hunting pressure, and what phase of the breeding cycle you catch them in. I have hunted in 8 states, and if you calculate "toughest" as time spent hunting per shot opportunity, my home state of MS would be the toughest. But then again, if I only hunted a week of my choice during the MS season, my time hunted to shot ratio would increase drastically. And of course my private land time to shot ratio is a lot better than my public land ratio in MS.
That being said, I have chased lightly pressured Merriam's in the Black Hills nearly a week straight before downing one...Some times it is as if nothing will work out right..The first time I ever hunted the Black Hills I had a bird down within a few hours.. Totally opposite results at the same place.
Have hunted public land Osceolas three times..And have gotten shots every trip...According to a lot of people on internet forums, these are some of the hardest to hunt. Definitely not from our experience.. But he always hunt opening week which seems to catch them in the perfect stage of breeding for this area with hens leaving them mid-morning.
For several years I limited out easily in MO on public land. But as turkey numbers began to decline, so did our harvests...A lot harder to kill when you hear half the birds you did a few years prior.
Kansas is now widely known as a prime turkey destination for out of state hunters..We have been twice, but focused strictly on Rios. Beyond belief, not all of the state is loaded with turkey. We have covered A TON of ground for public land Rios in Kansas, and nothing has been easy about it. We have been successful both trips,but it wasn't NEAR as "easy" as we expected. Now had we hunted the eastern portion of the state where more birds are, that would have likely changed.
Hunted Nebraska for the first time this year... Encountered some birds there that acted exactly like hard pressured MS public land birds..Couldn't believe it at first, how could they get this much pressure out there? After talking to a wildlife biologist in that area, our suspicions were confirmed..The particular area had been hit HARD by hunters the first two weeks of the season, and that was plenty for the turkeys to wise up. Moved a few miles off to hunt some more public land that was harder to access, and it was BAAM BAAM BAAM. Heard less birds at the second spot, but it definitely hadn't received the pressure the first spot had and we took advantage of it.
To sum it up, no matter where you go, there are going to be tough turkeys to kill. Too much variance in populations and hunting pressure over areas to name strictly one spot as the toughest.
My answer for the toughest place to kill turkeys in the U.S. = any heavily pressured public land without great populations of birds or land with few turkey in general.
the hardest turkey to kill is the turkey that isn't there.. we've all had those morning where you're in the woods by 4am sitting at the base of a tree by 4:15 and its DEAD silent all day and you wonder if theres anything within miles
I have been on those "easy" NE hunts, but let me assure you it is changing. I have seen the progression in several states now. Find some new ground covered in strutters that pay you no mind when you stop on the hwy just 50 yards away and even gobble when you call from the truck or honk the horn. Then a few more turkey thugs hear of this sacred ground and a couple years later you don't see as many strutters and when you stop to look at them, they walk away. Then many more turkey killers and turkey chasers come to see what all the fuss is about and before long you see very few strutters and they run if you start to slow down. Other than terrain the only difference is density and hunting pressure in my opinion. I like them all tough and easy, flat and steep, field or timber. I hunt some private leased ground that is difficult because the lease is full of turkey killers.
Eastern NC swamp birds are pretty tough. I also have hunted FL public land easterns and they are tough as well.
ALASKA! Only Mike Miller can do that!
After reading this; I now know I'm hunting in a tough area. And to think I just thought it was because I'm not good at it!! Seriously, I thought I had a decent area but a bit of pre-season scouting had me scrambling because the areas that had lots of birds last year were completely deserted this year. Not even a few tracks in the dust or mud. Not sure what happened but thought maybe they had a die-off of some type. I then had to do some in-season scouting/hunting to make it through.
Quote from: Gut_Pile on June 06, 2012, 02:31:16 PM
Southeastern gobblers. If you can kill them here you can kill them anywhere
But in all honesty, I havent found one anywhere too easy for me to kill yet. They're all tough.
I don't think there's any one toughest state. What makes turkeys difficult to hunt is their degree of "humanization". Take any of the states that have been mentioned and give me a few thousand contiguous acres absolutely devoid of humans and those turkeys will be relatively easy to hunt...they've never seen or heard a human and have never heard an artificial turkey call. That's why birds out west tend to be easier to hunt...less humanization.
Missouri this past season. Or maybe it was just me. :character0029:
Quote from: WildTigerTrout on June 06, 2012, 06:28:01 PM
I know gobblers in Pennsylvania can be very tough to bring to bag! Lots of hunting pressure here.
This!! It's not the BIRDS that make them tough to kill on the PA SGL's...it's all the friggin "hunters" stalking you and your calling, moving in on a bird you're working, the stumbling around with no thought for stealth or working the terrain and the general poor sportmanship that can be found on a lot of the game lands. I go to the game lands when I want a challenge kind of like when I fish the Lake Erie tributaries during a hot run...I like to see what I can do with all competition. If you can kill a bird on PA game lands the first weekend of the season, with all the doofuses running around the woods, you can kill one ANYWHERE.
Quote from: TRKYHTR on June 06, 2012, 05:26:54 PM
...I have to say that the hardest turkeys to hunt are the turkeys that are hunted the hardest...
THIS! I've ruined a few good honeyholes by pushing them too hard in my younger years...and a few more recently, too. Oops. :D
I have only hunted turkeys in LA and KS. The hardest ones I have found are the river bottom turkeys on public land in LA. The population has been down in recent years due severe spring flooding to make matters worse. Seems like there is always an obstacle in the way when trying to work a bird IF you can find one....
Hard hunted public land birds anywhere!
Quote from: BigAl on June 08, 2012, 11:01:57 PM
That's why birds out west tend to be easier to hunt...less humanization.
A lot of humanization in California. Most populated State out of all 50. Couple that with pockets or bands of turkeys with only so many on the lower elevation public lands, you have Rio's that can be tougher than the average Rio.
Again......a turkey is going to be tough regardless of where he is if he is being pressured. Some of the dumbest turkeys I've seen live in subdivisions with people everywhere. They are used to people. However, you start hunting them and they get the fear put in them, they suddenly wisen up very quickly.
There is private land that can be equally as tough to kill birds on that receives pressure. To me it is all about pressure and less about location and species.
Kevin
Public land MO birds are tough and I have had difficulties with some public land Rio/Eastern crosses near cities in KS and OK, but the toughes place I have hunted is Eastern/Southeastern Oklahoma. Between pressured birds and TOUGH terrain, it makes for tough (but fun) hunting.
I would have to say Nevada birds are few and far between there.
Quote from: slamman on June 14, 2012, 09:11:45 PM
I would have to say Nevada birds are few and far between there.
Now thats a darn good candidate.
I think it's all relative and pretty hard to make a Educated answer unless you've hunted specific states AND specific places within said states on a consitent basis.
I hunted a new place in Texas for the first time last year and it had never been hunted before and was covered with birds...it was almost like
stealing. But i've hunted places in the same state that had lesser habitat and more pressure and it was much more challenging. The birds weren't much different when you found them and were away from the crowd but if either of those places was the ONLY place you'd hunted in the state of tx, you'd probably come up with two different opinions of how hard they are to hunt.
Same thing in when I moved to Alabama this year- I killed my first bama bird on my second hunt as an alabamian and it was as easy as any turkey I've ever killed....that was on private land with great habitat. I went to other places that were tougher and I had to work harder for the birds because of more pressure, harder terrain (a tx boy wasn't used to those steep hills), and more pressure etc.
I honestly think turkey are turkey are turkey...they just do what they do. Some places have higher concentrations of them and less people out there boogering them up and it makes the birds easier to kill.
Southeast Mountain birds are tough! TN,NC and WV are rugged and steep with very smart gobblers
In the tail or in the foot!
Southern Illinois for me last 5th season!
Quote from: AngryBird on June 06, 2012, 04:54:43 PM
Inside the city limits! :funnyturkey:
I kinda like callin' to them city birds ( on 25 acres or more zoned agricultural of course ) you just have to learn their slang language. Like a single gobble right after a loud metallic banging sound means: That garbage truck just scared the scat out of me , and when a hen putts real loud and looks my way that means : you better get that call on outta here savage, you ain't foolin' nobody......
I've hunted 7 different states and agree with many that turkeys are turkeys anywhere, and the most difficult to kill consistently are in areas that receive the most hunting pressure or have less turkeys available to hunt. Timing is key too. Even the best areas with solid turkey numbers can prove not so easy to kill them at the wrong time. Even a few days can make all the difference. With that said, the toughest turkeys I have personally hunted are public land AL, MS, & AR......lots of pressure on each.